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2k11
Feb 7, 2011 19:21:42 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 7, 2011 19:21:42 GMT -5
someone want to remind me why we switched versions again?
ouch.
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2k11
Feb 7, 2011 20:14:54 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 7, 2011 20:14:54 GMT -5
It's necessary when we reach a certain point, and that point had been reached. If just for the openings we were unable to fill - it becomes harder to get new owners when people get the newer version - it was more than worth doing it.
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2k11
Feb 7, 2011 21:46:42 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 7, 2011 21:46:42 GMT -5
its only 1 year out of date. not everyone goes out and buys Madden 20XX when it comes out...
I haven't checked other teams, but my team gets obliterated...again
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2k11
Feb 7, 2011 23:27:37 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 7, 2011 23:27:37 GMT -5
It's not as if it wasn't going to happen to anyone. It has been clear from the start that some players were going to be re-rated, and we had no control over that. It will happen to every team, don't worry about it.
I look at your White Sox and I still see a team with a ton of talent, who will contend once again. Obliterated is an exageration, and a really big one. I'm not going to believe one second that your team has been destroyed, not even when I compare the current file to the last one in 2k10. Especially not when I compare it, actually.
The 2k11 may be only 1 year out of date, but it offers some improvements that will make the league better in the long run. I remember you didn't like the switch from 2k4 to 2k8 either, but looking back on it, that was the best move we ever did, and one that should have taken place earlier. There's also increased difficulties at finding new owners at some point. Not all buyers get the latest version, but a lot do, and it is by experience that we can say it gets harder to find new owners.
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2k11
Feb 7, 2011 23:49:27 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 7, 2011 23:49:27 GMT -5
i understand it would be harder to get new owners, but still not hard.
Greg Brock, Andre Dawson, Myron White, Kelvin Torve, Mark Knudson, Ed Vosberg, hell even Andy van Slyke all get destroyed compared to what they would be in 2k10 next season.
White i dont care much about because he was never going to be resigned after this season anyway.
Dawson was going to last another 5-6 years with his rating in 2k10, now he doesnt last 1 more.
Brock would going to last until 1989, now lasts half a season. which wouldnt be bad because i can free release him, though my only other 1b also got destroyed. (torve)
Mark Knudson was a stud that would play for me another 5 seasons in 2k10, now he wouldn't be good enough to be picked out of FA.
same with Vosberg.
Van slyke is still good, but his power goes to nil.
Not to mention prospects that were extremely important (Chuck Knoblauch) who would have been a guarenteed 96+ overall guy now ends in the 80s somewhere.
I have not had time to look at other teams, but i doubt they got that decimated.
*edit and with more sims, you can add Shawon Dunston and Bob Geren to the list of scrap.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 0:02:33 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 8, 2011 0:02:33 GMT -5
shit, just make it my entire team except Barrett who cant go any lower anyway and Tom Edens who is actually helped. everyone else is goes to shit depending on the sim.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 0:07:56 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 8, 2011 0:07:56 GMT -5
You're over-reacting, Greg. But just to be certain, are you looking at your players from 2k11 version 13.08?
I too see that some players have dropped, but the drops I see are a few points in predicted stats. And you are overlooking an important aspect here: pitchers. The hitters you name trying to convince us that they're not going to be great anymore, what's that? Every team has had players get re-rated a bit, hitters as well as pitchers. All in all, while hitters lose a few points in predicted stats, so will pitchers and so will defenses, so what we're looking at is players performing the same way than before. Andre Dawson is not going to turn into Mark Lemke and Andy Van Slyke will not turn into Spike Owen.
I have yet to find a player that was REALLY destroyed. Destroyed doesn't mean dropping a few points on a predicted. There may be some, but those I have looked at so far don't fit that description.
I have looked at other teams, and perfectly know that the White Sox aren't, as you seem to think, the only team that got some of its players re-rated. Take the time to compare the current file with the last one from 2k10, and look at other teams. This will help you relativize this issue, and realize that your team is as strong as before in relation to the rest of the league.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 0:13:39 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 8, 2011 0:13:39 GMT -5
shit, just make it my entire team except Barrett who cant go any lower anyway and Tom Edens who is actually helped. everyone else is goes to shit depending on the sim. Edens is a prospect, so between the turnover file (November) and now (April 1) he improved. So did Stablein, Aguilera, Renfroe, Egloff, etc, etc, etc...
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 1:02:58 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 8, 2011 1:02:58 GMT -5
predicted stats are not and have never been my focus. I look at ratings. Like contact, power, speed, eye etc.
in 2k10 Van Slyke had the following numbers
contact- 98 power- 95 speed- 91 eye- 99
in 2k11 (yes the right version) (after a season is simmed, not the current pre sim status)
Contact- 93 power-87 speed- 93 eye- 96
He goes from one of the most dynamic players ever to play in TMBL to your everyday average lead off man.
similar re-ratings are across the board on my team. The original people I mentioned always go through these re-ratings...most much worse than Van Slyke, the edits are merely random, but there is always atleast 1 or 2 more on top of the orignal however many I named that go through this.
Not even Tom Candiotti is safe from destruction.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 12:06:19 GMT -5
Post by sj on Feb 8, 2011 12:06:19 GMT -5
someone want to remind me why we switched versions again? ouch. I gave everyone the chance to back out and I got scolded. Vote was unanimous in favor. People need to avoid rash decisions about their teams right now. Although it's perfectly normal to focus on what's yours, an owner can't make a solid judgment call about player talent based only on his own team. You did some sims, I did dozens of them. I'll go into more detail tomorrow, I'm not spending time working on BBM leagues today, but at the end of the first season there will be between 68 and 78 players in the entire league rated 90+ in contact and 85+ in power. If they were evenly distributed, that would work out to an average of less than 3 per team. The White Sox have 5 of them, sometimes 6 depending on the sim. Advice to anyone following this: Use find player in commissioner mode to compare your team to others. Again, more detail tomorrow but for now; By the end of this season, .320 will be the new .340, and .300 will be the new .320. Doubt I'll be back to this site today, so if you need me, send email. I'll probably check it once in while as I'm decompressing by playing a Civ 4 game.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 12:45:09 GMT -5
Post by boobiegibson4three on Feb 8, 2011 12:45:09 GMT -5
"Greg Brock, Andre Dawson, Myron White, Kelvin Torve, Mark Knudson, Ed Vosberg, hell even Andy van Slyke all get destroyed compared to what they would be in 2k10 next seasoGreg Brock, Andre Dawson, Myron White, Kelvin Torve, Mark Knudson, Ed Vosberg, hell even Andy van Slyke all get destroyed compared to what they would be in 2k10 next seaso'
Im going off of memory but brock is a scrub going by ratings, dawson is out of peak, knudson has great control, but control should not be the only factor for a good pitcher ....
BTW your team is still loaded on offense IMHO
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 13:17:44 GMT -5
Post by CardinalsGM on Feb 8, 2011 13:17:44 GMT -5
I haven't done a ton of sims but one thing I have noticed in any mogul league is how each sim produces different results. I've had Fernandez maintain and look great as the Cardinals made the wild card. I reset and run another sim and by season's end he loses about 7 points of his overall and did badly. Next sim he does well. Don't know why but things change depending on how you sim as well. I did a couple of play the whole season sims, then did a couple a month at a time and the sims seem to change. Some players decreased either, others varied. But hey, isn't that like real baseball? Some guys seem to drop off all of the sudden, others hang in there, that's the challenge of running a team!
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 14:49:04 GMT -5
Post by Chi-Town Sox on Feb 8, 2011 14:49:04 GMT -5
"Greg Brock, Andre Dawson, Myron White, Kelvin Torve, Mark Knudson, Ed Vosberg, hell even Andy van Slyke all get destroyed compared to what they would be in 2k10 next seasoGreg Brock, Andre Dawson, Myron White, Kelvin Torve, Mark Knudson, Ed Vosberg, hell even Andy van Slyke all get destroyed compared to what they would be in 2k10 next seaso' Im going off of memory but brock is a scrub going by ratings, dawson is out of peak, knudson has great control, but control should not be the only factor for a good pitcher .... BTW your team is still loaded on offense IMHO Dawson has 1 more year of peak + 200 Longevity Brocks ratings in 2k10 contact 97 power 98 speed 62 eye 100 which was pretty decently stable through 1989 in every sim in 2k10. Brocks ratings in 2k11 control 84 power 86 speed 63 eye 90 Knudson has great control and movement, which does make a great pitcher- Ask Tom Hausman except in 2k11, he has neither. Even without anyone elses true lineup vs my true lineup, i am lucky to win 90 games in all of my sims, and probably a 70% chance at a playoff spot, where in 2k10 i would be all but guarenteed. Why do we always switch when I finally have a good team to compete? it happend in 2k4 where I built the red sox from NOTHING into a powerhouse, only to see it fall by switching versions. Once again this is going to happen.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 15:25:26 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 8, 2011 15:25:26 GMT -5
Knudson has great control and movement, which does make a great pitcher- Ask Tom Hausman except in 2k11, he has neither. Even without anyone elses true lineup vs my true lineup, i am lucky to win 90 games in all of my sims, and probably a 70% chance at a playoff spot, where in 2k10 i would be all but guarenteed. Why do we always switch when I finally have a good team to compete? it happend in 2k4 where I built the red sox from NOTHING into a powerhouse, only to see it fall by switching versions. Once again this is going to happen. You're over-evaluating Hausman. He had a great year, but his numbers truly were advantaged by the team behind him which had superior defense and support. He was lucky enough to be on one of the few teams that made him look so good. But he's quite finished. Next season, he'll be six years out of peak, and had we remained with the 2k10, few teams would have taken a chance on him despite his great control and movement. Hausman's health hangs by a thread, and his chances at putting up another great season are over, no matter what game we would be using. I too have done several sims since the file came out, and I have seen your team do the playoffs on a regular basis. Heck, I've even seen them win 111 games and more than 100 a whole bunch of times, how's that for a destruction? What's that about switching version only when you have a good team? You really think this is a conspiration of some sort? For crying out loud, Greg, you left TMBL the first time because you thought the switch had destroyed the Red Sox. A new owner came in, and by 1971 he took your former team to the playoffs thanks to his own skills but also to a lot of the players you had put on that team. Are these the Boston Red Sox you claim were destroyed because of the switch? Yes, they are! And guess what: they were not destroyed. You're making this dramatic for no reason. You're a good owner, you have proved it, and what you did with either Boston or Chicago had less to do with ratings than you seem to think.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 15:32:05 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 8, 2011 15:32:05 GMT -5
I haven't done a ton of sims but one thing I have noticed in any mogul league is how each sim produces different results. I've had Fernandez maintain and look great as the Cardinals made the wild card. I reset and run another sim and by season's end he loses about 7 points of his overall and did badly. Next sim he does well. Don't know why but things change depending on how you sim as well. I did a couple of play the whole season sims, then did a couple a month at a time and the sims seem to change. Some players decreased either, others varied. But hey, isn't that like real baseball? Some guys seem to drop off all of the sudden, others hang in there, that's the challenge of running a team! I couldn't have said it better myself. This game is extremely random, has always been and will always be so. But then, so is baseball in real life. Who knew that, after hitting 34 homeruns and driving in 100 runs for the Padres in 1993 as a 24 year old outfielder, that Phil Plantier would be out of baseball 4 years later? We can never tell. It is like real baseball, and without it, where would be the challenge? We already have access to too much information, such as peak lenght, peak end, longevity, potential, etc... As much as I can hate having a player I counted on to be re-rated, I know that I'd hate it even more if the game didn't have any randomness in it, because it would then be always exactly like I planned, and I'd call that boring.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 18:00:03 GMT -5
Post by boobiegibson4three on Feb 8, 2011 18:00:03 GMT -5
i was way off on BROCK...oops
but seriously think my team is a TWO TIME DEFENDING champion and now everything has changed and im not complaining. BTW your team wins the division in all of my sims so far with the brewers almost always second.
Also you didnt BUILD this white sox team.... another owner took a horrible sox team and drafted some really good players and traded for dawson. Your super stars of slyke, dawson, candiotti were by a previous owner. I think you drafted mitchell and traded for dunston and brock.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 18:57:23 GMT -5
Post by Exposgm on Feb 8, 2011 18:57:23 GMT -5
Also you didnt BUILD this white sox team.... another owner took a horrible sox team and drafted some really good players and traded for dawson. Your super stars of slyke, dawson, candiotti were by a previous owner. I think you drafted mitchell and traded for dunston and brock. Although it is true that Greg took over a team that already had some talent in place, I am not ready to deny him the skills of taking that team to a higher level. Owners come and go all the time, and a bunch of them have taken over teams that were about ready to win and within a few moves the team was crap again. Greg didn't draft certain players, but the ones he acquired either through trading or free agency were the right ones. And some people may not agree with me, but not trading some of the players that were on the team when taking over also was the right thing to do. After all, there are not that many owners who have been with their teams from the start. Several of us took over a team that was either in bad or good shape. You took over the Twins a long while ago, and from what I remember, that team wasn't in shambles.
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2k11
Feb 8, 2011 19:43:55 GMT -5
Post by boobiegibson4three on Feb 8, 2011 19:43:55 GMT -5
it wasnt...it was pretty loaded and i think hes a good owner. I was just trying to let him see that 2k11 could open up new opportunities. He might think it killed his team, but maybe its more of an opportunity to shape his team even more. Im sure the trade market will be very active this season.
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